Why you should refuse a FST and demand the BAT
Author |
Message |
kimberman
|
Post subject: Why you should refuse a FST and demand the BAT Posted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 8:15 pm |
|
Wise Elder |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=73_1252127598.jpg) |
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:48 pm Posts: 2782 Location: St. Paul
|
Woman Has Half a Glass of Wine, .02 BAC, Gets Charged With Felony DUI.
http://www.theagitator.com/2008/04/15/w ... elony-dui/
Another reason to NEVER cooperate with the police. Be polite, be firm in saying "no," and make them respect you. You can win the dominance game by burying them in courtesy.
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
amaixner
|
Post subject: Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:17 am |
|
Joined: Sun Jul 02, 2006 5:05 pm Posts: 20 Location: Iowa
|
Just to be clear, I haven't read the statute in a while:
If you are driving or carrying, you can be required to take a test if an officer believes you may be intoxicated.
Does FST refer to a blow test, or a dexterity test?
I assume that BAT is a drawn blood test?
Do you then have the right to choose between either a dexterity test, a portable breath test, or going to the station for a needle blood test?
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
bkrafft
|
Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:50 pm |
|
Longtime Regular |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=599.jpg) |
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2006 3:02 pm Posts: 571
|
IANAL etc., but I understand that you can decline a field sobriety test and request another.
"Officer I am somewhat dyslexic so I can hardly recite the alphabet forwards much less backwards, is there another test I could do?"
"Officer I would balance on one foot, close my eyes, lean back and touch my nose but I have had foot surgery (pulled a muscle in my back, twisted my ankle, whatever) is there another test I could do?"
"Officer I would walk a straight line heel to toe, but I have knock knees, so I am physically not able to do that, is there another test I could do?"
The one phrase that you should at all costs avoid is any variation of "Hell I couldn't do that even if I <I>was</i> sober!"
_________________ If the Government does not obey the Constitution, then what is Treason? -- Unknown
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
mnlitig8r
|
Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:09 pm |
|
Senior Member |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=2064.jpg) |
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:30 pm Posts: 180 Location: Twin Cities
|
bkrafft wrote: The one phrase that you should at all costs avoid is any variation of "Hell I couldn't do that even if I <I>was</i> sober!"
I can't even begin to tell you how many of my clients have said that very thing. Needless to say, it makes it kind of tough to defend a case like that.
_________________ "We, as criminal defense lawyers, are forced to deal with some of the lowest people on earth, people who have no sense of right and wrong, people who will lie in court to get what they want, people who do not care who gets hurt in the process. It is our job – our sworn duty as criminal defense lawyers – to protect our clients from those people." -- Cynthia Rosenberry, a DePaul University law professor, criminal defense attorney and founding member of the Georgia Innocence Project
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
mnlitig8r
|
Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:12 pm |
|
Senior Member |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=2064.jpg) |
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:30 pm Posts: 180 Location: Twin Cities
|
bkrafft wrote: IANAL etc., but I understand that you can decline a field sobriety test and request another.
As I wrote in a past posting, refusing the balance and coordination tests is a good idea. They are very subjective and often improperly conducted, meaning the deck is even more stacked against the driver. There's no requirement that you perform them (or try to do so) so I advise people to politely decline.
As for a portable breath test ("PBT"), if you are asked to take one of these I would suggest that you do. The law allows the cops to arrest you if they have sufficient cause to ask you to take the PBT and you refuse. Besides, the results of that test cannot be used against you to prove your alcohol concentration, only whether the officer had sufficient cause to arrest you.
_________________ "We, as criminal defense lawyers, are forced to deal with some of the lowest people on earth, people who have no sense of right and wrong, people who will lie in court to get what they want, people who do not care who gets hurt in the process. It is our job – our sworn duty as criminal defense lawyers – to protect our clients from those people." -- Cynthia Rosenberry, a DePaul University law professor, criminal defense attorney and founding member of the Georgia Innocence Project
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
johninminnesota
|
Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:51 pm |
|
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 8:49 am Posts: 146
|
Here's a suggestion... don't drink and drive.
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
mnlitig8r
|
Post subject: Posted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 10:08 pm |
|
Senior Member |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=2064.jpg) |
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:30 pm Posts: 180 Location: Twin Cities
|
johninminnesota wrote: Here's a suggestion... don't drink and drive.
Yep. That was my suggestion right here: http://www.twincitiescarry.com/forum/vi ... 9330#99330
_________________ "We, as criminal defense lawyers, are forced to deal with some of the lowest people on earth, people who have no sense of right and wrong, people who will lie in court to get what they want, people who do not care who gets hurt in the process. It is our job – our sworn duty as criminal defense lawyers – to protect our clients from those people." -- Cynthia Rosenberry, a DePaul University law professor, criminal defense attorney and founding member of the Georgia Innocence Project
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
Long Ago LEO
|
Post subject: Posted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 10:33 pm |
|
Senior Member |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=2271.jpg) |
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:43 am Posts: 208 Location: St. Cloud
|
One of my favorites: "Of course, occifer - I already know these and will be happy to balance my alphabet backwards while touching my heel to my nose."
And they can come awfully close to doing this some times! ![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
tepin
|
Post subject: Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 7:33 am |
|
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:00 pm Posts: 1064 Location: Minneapolis, MN
|
+1
The HCSO told me the dexterity test was mostly for the dash cam and doesnt mean much more other than having something fun to watch in court. The HCSO also said that everyone they pull over that has been drinking and they ask, "Have you had anything to drink tonight?" - the response is almost always "a couple" so they are obligated to take next steps - for public safety reasons. What I learned from that is to always reply "no" regardless. No reason to self-incriminate. One other thing, according to the HCSO, is that 1 in 10 cars on the road after mignight are driven by drunks. The lesson here is to be home by 11pm and drive where there is lots of traffic as to blend-in w/ others or as previously said, dont drink & drive.
mnlitig8r wrote: bkrafft wrote: IANAL etc., but I understand that you can decline a field sobriety test and request another. As I wrote in a past posting, refusing the balance and coordination tests is a good idea. They are very subjective and often improperly conducted, meaning the deck is even more stacked against the driver. There's no requirement that you perform them (or try to do so) so I advise people to politely decline. As for a portable breath test ("PBT"), if you are asked to take one of these I would suggest that you do. The law allows the cops to arrest you if they have sufficient cause to ask you to take the PBT and you refuse. Besides, the results of that test cannot be used against you to prove your alcohol concentration, only whether the officer had sufficient cause to arrest you.
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
tepin
|
Post subject: Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 7:34 am |
|
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:00 pm Posts: 1064 Location: Minneapolis, MN
|
im not as think as you drunk i am.
Long Ago LEO wrote: One of my favorites: "Of course, occifer - I already know these and will be happy to balance my alphabet backwards while touching my heel to my nose." And they can come awfully close to doing this some times! ![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
tepin
|
Post subject: Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 9:19 am |
|
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:00 pm Posts: 1064 Location: Minneapolis, MN
|
Just now reading the article...
Quote: The sketchy sobriety tests, plus Wilcutt's admission that she'd taken a hydrocodone pill, were enough to book her. Another reason not to talk to the cops... Quote: Numerous academic studies have shown that inhalers can artificially increase a breathalyzer's blood alcohol reading. But the cops administered the breath test anyway, just minutes after she used her inhaler, Wilcutt says. Sure enough, it gave an inflated reading of 0.048.
Good to know. Her inhaler doubled her reading.
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
tman065
|
Post subject: Posted: Sun Apr 20, 2008 1:56 pm |
|
Longtime Regular |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=993_1306738603.jpg) |
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:19 am Posts: 810 Location: Northern MN
|
Although the reading "on the street" may be skewed if you'd just used your inhaler, or slammed a drink, or used mouthwash, or whatever, when you get to the point at the station where the "official" intox test is done, the officer will certify that he/she has observed you for at least 15 minutes. This allows time for leftovers to disipate from inside your mouth.
_________________ Proud, Service Oriented, Rural LEO, or "BADGED COWBOY" Certified MN Carry Permit Instructor
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
Jeremiah
|
Post subject: Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 9:15 am |
|
Raving Moderate |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=392_1288814565.gif) |
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 12:46 pm Posts: 1292 Location: Minneapolis
|
tepin wrote: im not as think as you drunk i am. Long Ago LEO wrote: One of my favorites: "Of course, occifer - I already know these and will be happy to balance my alphabet backwards while touching my heel to my nose." And they can come awfully close to doing this some times! ![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
"Starkle, starkle, little twink,
Who the #$%@ are you? I think..."
_________________ I'm liberal, pro-choice, and I carry a gun. Any questions?
My real name is Jeremiah (go figure).
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
tepin
|
Post subject: Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:21 pm |
|
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:00 pm Posts: 1064 Location: Minneapolis, MN
|
Ewe must bee drunc!
Jeremiah wrote: tepin wrote: im not as think as you drunk i am. Long Ago LEO wrote: One of my favorites: "Of course, occifer - I already know these and will be happy to balance my alphabet backwards while touching my heel to my nose." And they can come awfully close to doing this some times! ![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif) "Starkle, starkle, little twink, Who the #$%@ are you? I think..."
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
bkrafft
|
Post subject: Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:10 pm |
|
Longtime Regular |
![User avatar](./download/file.php?avatar=599.jpg) |
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2006 3:02 pm Posts: 571
|
tman065 wrote: ... when you get to the point at the station where the "official" intox test is done, the officer will certify that he/she has observed you for at least 15 minutes. This allows time for leftovers to disipate from inside your mouth.
This is why you should belch as vociferously as you can just before you blow. A burp can bring fresh alcohol from your stomach up into your esophagus and mouth, throwing the reading off, so in theory they have to wait another 15 minutes (some states it's 30 minutes) before they can make you blow again.
Once again, IANAL, YMMV and it probably is not a good idea to drink and drive.
_________________ If the Government does not obey the Constitution, then what is Treason? -- Unknown
|
|
|
|
![](images/spacer.gif) |
This is a static archive the Twin Cities Carry forum, maintained as a public service by the current forum of record, The Minnesota Carry Forum.
All times are UTC - 6 hours
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 24 guests |
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum
|