CSM: AK-47 Background Check Bill Stuck in Committee
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Lenny7
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Post subject: CSM: AK-47 Background Check Bill Stuck in Committee Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:54 am |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:09 am Posts: 1060 Location: Savage, MN
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From Citizens for a "Safer" Minnesota:
Quote: AK-47 Background Check Bill Stuck in Committee -- Take Action Today! Dear Lenny7, The New York Times reports that Mexican drug cartels are assassinating police officials with high-powered weapons bought in the U.S. The cartels are taking advantage of loose U.S. gun laws and an expired assault weapons ban - with disastrous results for Mexico. The gun lobby would have you believe it can't happen here -- and it is pressuring key Minnesota committees to reject a common-sense bill to close the gun show/Internet loophole. These committees need to hear from you! Click here to act now! http://salsa.democracyinaction.org/o/22 ... _KEY=26839The Minnesota Chiefs of Police Association supports H.F. 953, aware that we have gangs in Minnesota, too. It makes no sense to leave a gaping loophole in our law that allows the sale, with no background check, of pistols and assault weapons by unlicensed sellers. This bill deserves a hearing! Minnesota needs to have a law to stop such transactions as in-state web site sales that are really trafficking; private sales like the sales in Pillager, MN that fueled a pipeline of guns to Twin Cities gangs; and gun show sales with no background check, like the one that armed the Hennepin County Government Center shooter. Click here to take action today! http://salsa.democracyinaction.org/o/22 ... _KEY=26839Thank you for all you do, Heather Martens Executive Director, Citizens for a Safer Minnesota/Protect Minnesota Read more: U.S. is vast arms bazaar for Mexican drug cartels http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/26/us/26borders.html"The sheer volume of licensed dealers - more than 6,600 along the border alone, many of them operating out of their houses - makes policing them a tall order. Currently the A.T.F. has about 200 agents assigned to the task." "...Some of the smuggled weapons are also bought from private individuals at gun shows, and the law requires no notification of the authorities in those cases." 22,500 Guns Trafficked Through Unlicensed Sellers http://www.treas.gov/press/releases/ls723.htm
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joelr
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:57 am |
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The Man |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am Posts: 7970 Location: Minneapolis MN
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Have we gotten an answer as whether or not the MCA actually supports this gun registration bill?
_________________ Just a guy.
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kimberman
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 12:10 pm |
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Wise Elder |
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Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:48 pm Posts: 2782 Location: St. Paul
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joelr wrote: Have we gotten an answer as whether or not the MCA actually supports this gun registration bill?
We need this information. ASAP
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joelr
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 12:25 pm |
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The Man |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am Posts: 7970 Location: Minneapolis MN
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kimberman wrote: joelr wrote: Have we gotten an answer as whether or not the MCA actually supports this gun registration bill? We need this information. ASAPAgreed; I put in a call to the executive director an hour ago. No response yet.
I don't think it would be a bad thing if other folks would make a polite inquiry. After I showed up there, in the wake of some of their less adorable activities, with what I know they thought (but I didn't say; it only occurred to me later) were two FBI guys in tow, there's been a certain . . . concern about me at the MCA/MSA.
_________________ Just a guy.
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Mosin
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:05 pm |
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Eagle-eyed watcher of legislation |
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2008 2:34 pm Posts: 185 Location: Bloomington
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kimberman wrote: joelr wrote: Have we gotten an answer as whether or not the MCA actually supports this gun registration bill? We need this information. ASAP
The Executive Director is out of the office until tomorrow morning.
There has been no official statement made. Right now the executive committee is trying to figure out where Paymar is getting his info from. And they are considering what an official statement would be.
_________________ April 19, 1775 the strongest military in the world attacked farmers and townspeople formed as militia in Concord. One year, 3 months, and 25,000 american casualties later, we would begin forming a government based on limited powers and individual liberties.
It's your constitution. They died for it. Read it. Know it.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution ... rview.html
http://LibertyMinnesota.com
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Dave Pendleton
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:48 pm |
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Senior Member |
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Joined: Wed May 07, 2008 4:05 pm Posts: 312 Location: SE Metro
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What if they do or don't?
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joelr
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 4:19 pm |
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The Man |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am Posts: 7970 Location: Minneapolis MN
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Dave Pendleton wrote: What if they do or don't? We handle it. If we can confirm that the CSM folks are lying, again, about support for their gun registration bill, we call them liars. Publicly. Ditto for Paymar.
We don't do that unless we can confirm it.
If the MCA wants to cross the self-defense movement, again, they can do so. We have very long memories.
_________________ Just a guy.
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Mosin
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 8:42 pm |
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Eagle-eyed watcher of legislation |
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2008 2:34 pm Posts: 185 Location: Bloomington
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From MCPA
Quote: The Minnesota Chiefs of Police Association sent a letter to Citizens for a Safer Minnesota stating we give limited support of this bill. The issues we had concern about were Nics checks a requirement at gun shows. We are not participating in the process to have this bill passed. If you have further questions, you may contact our Executive Director Harlan Johnson. Mary Henning Communications and Training Coordinator mary@mnchiefs.org
Looks like Paymar may have streeeeetched the truth a little on that one.
_________________ April 19, 1775 the strongest military in the world attacked farmers and townspeople formed as militia in Concord. One year, 3 months, and 25,000 american casualties later, we would begin forming a government based on limited powers and individual liberties.
It's your constitution. They died for it. Read it. Know it.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution ... rview.html
http://LibertyMinnesota.com
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kimberman
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:12 pm |
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Wise Elder |
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Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:48 pm Posts: 2782 Location: St. Paul
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The Chief's Association's position is unintelligible.
All the police groups that I've spoken with say they aren't pushing any gun-related bills this year. CSM and Paymar are just a front, like the CPUSA in the 1950s, for the Brady Campaign's national effort to "Californicate" other state's gun laws.
They have the exact thing Paymar wants in California (for 10 years) and a recent Study by University of Maryland criminologists demonstrates that ALL THE HASSLE IS FOR NAUGHT. There is NO reduction in murder, suicide, or crime as a result of making all firearm transfers go through FFL dealers. But there is harassment -- some people have to drive 50 miles to find a cooperating dealer and everyone has to pay an extra $100 to have the transfer recorded in the dealer's bound book (i.e., "registered" Mr. Paymar).
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Mosin
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:44 pm |
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Eagle-eyed watcher of legislation |
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2008 2:34 pm Posts: 185 Location: Bloomington
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Copy of letter from MNCPA to Citizens for Safer Minnesota
Quote: March 6, 2009
Heather Martens President Citizens for Safer Minnesota
Re: H.F. 953
Dear President Martens
The Minnesota Chiefs of Police Association supports the effort of Citizens for Safer Minnesota to change the current Minnesota law to include background checks be conducted at gun shows throughout Minnesota. Recent news reports indicate the growing number of guns purchased by straw buyers in the U.S. are being found in Mexico and used by drug dealers.
Background checks could be easily accomplished at gun shows and would relieve the concerns of the vendors that an effort was made to ensure that a person not eligible for take[sic] delivery of a firearm was legally denied and the public safety was maintained.
Sincerely
Harlan Johnson Executive Director Minnesota Chiefs of Police Association
According to this they support the bill. Harlan Johnson is gone now for the day so I couldn't get clarity. I do have a message in to him.
_________________ April 19, 1775 the strongest military in the world attacked farmers and townspeople formed as militia in Concord. One year, 3 months, and 25,000 american casualties later, we would begin forming a government based on limited powers and individual liberties.
It's your constitution. They died for it. Read it. Know it.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution ... rview.html
http://LibertyMinnesota.com
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Mosin
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:04 pm |
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Eagle-eyed watcher of legislation |
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2008 2:34 pm Posts: 185 Location: Bloomington
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kimberman wrote: The Chief's Association's position is unintelligible.
All the police groups that I've spoken with say they aren't pushing any gun-related bills this year. CSM and Paymar are just a front, like the CPUSA in the 1950s, for the Brady Campaign's national effort to "Californicate" other state's gun laws.
They have the exact thing Paymar wants in California (for 10 years) and a recent Study by University of Maryland criminologists demonstrates that ALL THE HASSLE IS FOR NAUGHT. There is NO reduction in murder, suicide, or crime as a result of making all firearm transfers go through FFL dealers. But there is harassment -- some people have to drive 50 miles to find a cooperating dealer and everyone has to pay an extra $100 to have the transfer recorded in the dealer's bound book (i.e., "registered" Mr. Paymar).
If anyone is interested in the UMD study
http://www.closup.umich.edu/research/wo ... -final.pdf
_________________ April 19, 1775 the strongest military in the world attacked farmers and townspeople formed as militia in Concord. One year, 3 months, and 25,000 american casualties later, we would begin forming a government based on limited powers and individual liberties.
It's your constitution. They died for it. Read it. Know it.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution ... rview.html
http://LibertyMinnesota.com
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tman065
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 11:00 pm |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:19 am Posts: 810 Location: Northern MN
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Mosin wrote: Copy of letter from MNCPA to Citizens for Safer Minnesota Quote:
Harlan Johnson Executive Director Minnesota Chiefs of Police Association
Harlan and I met professionally twice when I was in college a couple of decades ago... I deserved both of the summons' he wrote.
Our relationship is a little more friendly now, and I would be willing to contact him about the Chiefs Associaton's position. I do think he will give me time, but I don't believe that the chiefs will rethink their position.
_________________ Proud, Service Oriented, Rural LEO, or "BADGED COWBOY" Certified MN Carry Permit Instructor
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joelr
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 5:32 am |
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The Man |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am Posts: 7970 Location: Minneapolis MN
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tman065 wrote: Mosin wrote: Copy of letter from MNCPA to Citizens for Safer Minnesota Quote:
Harlan Johnson Executive Director Minnesota Chiefs of Police Association
Harlan and I met professionally twice when I was in college a couple of decades ago... I deserved both of the summons' he wrote. Our relationship is a little more friendly now, and I would be willing to contact him about the Chiefs Associaton's position. I do think he will give me time, but I don't believe that the chiefs will rethink their position. That's okay. I think that silence gives consent, and being silent about the Chiefs signing onto the CSM gun registration bill is something we don't want to do.
_________________ Just a guy.
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Mosin
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 7:51 am |
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Eagle-eyed watcher of legislation |
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2008 2:34 pm Posts: 185 Location: Bloomington
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From Harlan:
Quote: Yes, we support that NICS check be conducted at gun shows where vendors have not been afforded the protection that larger retail dealers have to ensure that the sale of a firearm is to a legitimate purchaser. It is no more taxing or time consuming than a citizen would do if they purchased a gun a Gander Mountain.
We do not consider vendors at gun shows to be “private sales.”
We support the concept that private citizen sales as a non-dealer seller (or giving a gun) to another private citizen. We do not support the age old H.R. 45 that has been around for years and without any support or merit that would ban causal sales or gifting of guns to friends and family members.
Straw buyers, unfortunately, are being blamed for 6500 deaths in Mexico by the Mexican government.
I hope this answers your questions satisfactorily.
Harlan Johnson
_________________ April 19, 1775 the strongest military in the world attacked farmers and townspeople formed as militia in Concord. One year, 3 months, and 25,000 american casualties later, we would begin forming a government based on limited powers and individual liberties.
It's your constitution. They died for it. Read it. Know it.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution ... rview.html
http://LibertyMinnesota.com
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DeanC
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 8:01 am |
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Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:54 am Posts: 5270 Location: Minneapolis
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That's weaselly.
FFL's at gun shows must still conduct a NICS check already. He agrees that private citizens shouldn't have to run a NICS check.
But he is inventing a new third class of seller: a vendor. What is a vendor? A non-licensed gun dealer? I think we already have laws covering those activities.
_________________ I am defending myself... in favor of that!
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