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BB Guns
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Post subject: *  Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 11:30 am |
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| Senior Member |
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Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 10:16 am
Posts: 120
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Last edited by BB Guns on Thu Feb 02, 2006 8:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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dismal
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 1:21 pm |
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| Senior Member |
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Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 12:12 pm
Posts: 330
Location: Rochester, MN
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The Raddison hotel on Broadway in Rochester was posted for a few years, but the signs came down about 6 months ago.
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dustoff
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 3:10 pm |
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Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:14 am
Posts: 68
Location: Plymouth, MN
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The Hyatt Regency in MSP is posted
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Andrew Rothman
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 3:52 pm |
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| Longtime Regular |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 10:24 am
Posts: 6767
Location: Twin Cities
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My understanding has always been that your hotel room is your home while you are there.
I would assume that that would make the hotel the landlord, and that they could not post, nor prevent you or your guests from carrying in common areas or your room.
I can't back that up with anything, and I'm sure not a lawyer. Perhaps Paul or Joe could comment?
_________________
* NRA, UT, MADFI certified Minnesota Permit to Carry instructor, and one of 66,513 law-abiding permit holders. Read my blog.
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phorvick
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 4:46 pm |
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| Forum Moderator |
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:37 pm
Posts: 1571
Location: Detroit Lakes, MN
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Andrew Rothman wrote: My understanding has always been that your hotel room is your home while you are there.
I would assume that that would make the hotel the landlord, and that they could not post, nor prevent you or your guests from carrying in common areas or your room.
I can't back that up with anything, and I'm sure not a lawyer. Perhaps Paul or Joe could comment? 1. I am an attorney, yes; that and $1.25 gets you a Coke here at work; I have never researched that specific area, but since the "advice" here is free (and worth what you paid)...
2. it is my belief, subject to statutory or case law correction that...
a. your rented room can be treated as your residence for purposes of carrying a handgun; any signs purporting to ban guns in your room would be invalid;
b. the business could, if they opted, ban employees from carrying on their property or parking areas;
c. the business could, post signage banning guns in the non-residential areas such as lobby, bar, restaurants etc
d. then again, if I am wrong and you carried into your room and had to use a handgun in self defense, the validity of the sign/posting/ban etc seems rather moot and inconsequential.
You may rely on this to your detriment  I have NOT researched this. I am content with my interpretation.
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Paul Horvick
http://shootingsafely.com
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Contact us to schedule a class for you and your friends, and check our website for more information http://shootingsafely.com
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ttousi
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 5:00 pm |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 11:20 am
Posts: 3311
Location: St. Paul, MN.
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Based on my discussions (and what is presented in class) with the attorney that conducts our legal portion, I agree with Paul. Temporary domicile etc. We basically treat it as Paul addresses it above.
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http://is.gd/37LKr
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kimberman
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 11:42 am |
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| Wise Elder |
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Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:48 pm
Posts: 2782
Location: St. Paul
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I agree with Mr. Horvick subject to some minor differences shown in CAPS.
phorvick wrote: 1. I am an attorney, yes; that and $1.25 gets you a Coke here at work; I have never researched that specific area, but since the "advice" here is free (and worth what you paid)... 2. it is my belief, subject to statutory or case law correction that... a. your rented room can be treated as your residence for purposes of carrying a handgun; any signs purporting to ban guns in your room would be invalid; YES b. the business could, if they opted, ban employees from carrying on their property or parking areas; NO BAN IN THE PARKING AREAS. c. the business could, post signage banning guns in the non-residential areas such as lobby, bar, restaurants etc BUT ONLY AS TO NON-TENENTS (AND THEIR GUESTS) - THE STATUTE (AS ENACTED TWICE) DRAWS NO DISTINCTION BETWEEN "common areas" AND "tenant" SPACES. SIGNAGE MUST COMPLY WITH SUBD. 17 (b) TO BE EFFECTIVE. d. then again, if I am wrong and you carried into your room and had to use a handgun in self defense, the validity of the sign/posting/ban etc seems rather moot and inconsequential. CORRECT. THE JUSTIFICATION FOR use OF A CARRIED FIREARM DEPENDS ON THE REASONABLY PERCEIVED THREAT. You may rely on this to your detriment I have NOT researched this.
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joelr
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 12:30 pm |
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| The Man |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
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I'm not a lawyer, but I do agree with Joe. My one concern is that some court in the metro area, in particular, might choose to redefine the term "tenant" so that the very specific requirements of the law wouldn't apply.
I think, though, despite some of the dogshit stupid rulings of local courts around gun issues that it's unlikely to get that far in the first place, and that even if it does, it's unlikely to happen. But not impossible.
I'm not nearly as worried about parking lots. It would be very hard to define away the law having established three classes of parking lots -- federal, school, and other -- and making it unambiguously clear that the right to carry can not be restricted by anybody in the third class.
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Just a guy.
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Erik_Pakieser
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Post subject: Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 10:56 pm |
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| Senior Member |
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Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2005 8:16 am
Posts: 364
Location: Minneapolis, MN
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Minnesota does have this law, however:
Quote: 327.73 Undesirable guests; ejection of, and refusal to admit. Subdivision 1. Innkeeper's right to eject. (a) An innkeeper may remove or cause to be removed from a hotel a guest or other person who: <points of the statute not related to firearms snipped> (4) the innkeeper reasonably believes has brought property into the hotel that may be dangerous to other persons, such as firearms or explosives; The way I read this, you could be ejected from a hotel if they think you are in posession of a gun, MPPA or not.
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SethB
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Post subject: Re: Hotels & Motels Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2005 12:25 am |
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Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 10:02 pm
Posts: 818
Location: downtown Mpls
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BB Guns wrote: Has anyone seen or know of a Hotel or Motel in Minnesota that is POSTED? The Millennium in downtown Mpls has occasionally been posted (when someone running a convention there wanted it to be). They didn't bother following the rules.
As for a hotel removing a guest who's carrying legally, they perhaps do have that right; but it would make billing interesting (not to mention compensation for recovery of any property left behind).
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mobocracy
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Post subject: Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2005 8:42 am |
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Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 6:55 pm
Posts: 986
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The Holiday Inn near MOA and the Airport was posted when I was there for a seminar in early November.
I seem to remember it looking like a fairly appropriate/official sign, other than the fact I thought the posting of a hotel wasn't quite appropriate ("temporary domicile").
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joelr
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Post subject: Re: Hotels & Motels Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2005 9:51 am |
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| The Man |
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Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:43 am
Posts: 7970
Location: Minneapolis MN
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SethB wrote: BB Guns wrote: Has anyone seen or know of a Hotel or Motel in Minnesota that is POSTED? The Millennium in downtown Mpls has occasionally been posted (when someone running a convention there wanted it to be). They didn't bother following the rules. I get the sense that many corporations who post -- well, many of the few corporations that post -- do it in a kind of pro forma way, just to make some of their noisy anti customers happy. The Millennium is one example -- and without going into the Mnstf Gun Wars at the moment; that's a subject for another day -- there seems to be an increasing lack of worry at the corporate level that permit holders are a problem. (It would be interesting to know what would've happened if Larry Sanderson's email had reached the desk when he intended for it to.)
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Just a guy.
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SethB
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Post subject: Re: Hotels & Motels Posted: Fri Dec 23, 2005 1:45 pm |
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Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 10:02 pm
Posts: 818
Location: downtown Mpls
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joelr wrote: (It would be interesting to know what would've happened if Larry Sanderson's email had reached the desk when he intended for it to.) Approximately what did happen: she would have called the bartender and asked if anything bad was happening, and he'd have said "no". (She wouldn't have had to reach him while he was asleep at home, that's all.)
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chinakay
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 9:53 pm |
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Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2005 9:42 am
Posts: 259
Location: SW metro
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The Best Western in Chaska has been posted from about Day One.
_________________
Ya can't miss fast enough to win.
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